Re: [Videolib] copyright AGAIN [Scanned]

Jessica Rosner (jrosner@kino.com)
Thu, 30 Oct 2008 11:41:21 -0400

Um Mark
Record companies are being KILLED, CD sales are off a cliff and the money
they get from say iTunes is not close to covering it . Record companies are
LOSING money for the most part , there have been massive cutbacks and
mergers, it is anything but a thriving business and I think that is what
Us distributors are very worried about. It should be noted that the music
market is being destroyed more or less by individuals even those pirating on
a big scale, schools on the other hand have made licensing deals in many
cases which of course is what all of us would like if all those really big
problems could be worked out.

On 10/30/08 11:29 AM, "Jerry Notaro" <notaro@stpt.usf.edu> wrote:

> I don't agree with Mark's analogy either, Jessica, but we have heard the
> same argument you are presenting from record companies when people started
> streaming music. Buying and managing music online is a reality and the
> rights and content holders are making tons of money because of it. If they
> would have stuck to selling music "only" on cd's, yes, they would be in
> trouble, but that didn't happen and they are thriving. Much as producers
> and distributors think librarians are trying to make a fast buck, it is
> going to be survival mode soon for content providers. People are demanding
> it and yes, they will pass and choose other content because of the format
> available.
>
> Jerry
>
> Jessica Rosner wrote:
>> More like you buy a house on the water in an area zoned for residential
>> use
>> only, but you decide you can
>> Make a bundle by tearing it down and building a 5 story hotel and allowing
>> hundreds of folks to the water.
>> You are sued because YOU VIOLATED the law that said the property was for
>> residential use ONLY.
>>
>> You want to take material marked for home use ( Films) for which a
>> generous
>> exemption already exists allowing you to
>> Use them in ³Face to face² teaching instruction IN the class with the
>> instructor present , rip them off again LITERALLY by breaking encryption
>> which is unequivocally against the law except for CLIPS for film classes,
>> digitize and stream them so that students can watch them anywhere they
>> find
>> ³convenient².
>>
>> As per previous post I hope you wont mind when after all the small film
>> distributors are gone because we could not sell
>> 50 copies of a film a rare film we spent $30,000 to get out ( and that is
>> for a REALLY cheap one) to universities , the schools decide there is no
>> need for librarians now that Mega Distributor corp. of America offers
>> schools one stop shopping where
>> ALL FILMS AND BOOKS are digitized and you only pay them a few thousand
>> bucks
>> a year to give your campus access to
>> All of it.. Keep in mind Mega distributors has of course Merely bought one
>> copy of the film or book , digitized it and made it available to any
>> campus
>> that subscribes to itıs service After all the copy they bought for $ 14.98
>> from Baker & Taylor was a LEGAL copy so the school didnıt even have to buy
>> that one. No need for rights or librarians, think of the money they can
>> save.
>> This is the logical conclusion of taking copyrighted material ,digitizing
>> & streaming it why would any budget conscience
>> Institution do otherwise ?
>>
>>
>> On 10/30/08 10:55 AM, "Mark Kopp" <mkopp@iu08.org> wrote:
>>
>>> The most important term in your commentŠ²should²
>>>
>>> And on the other side of your ³should², some producer/rights holder is
>>> claiming they ³should² get paid every single time someone views their
>>> stuff.
>>> Itıs the very reason they want the law to prevent us from tampering with
>>> the
>>> ³technological measures². The less exemptions there are, the more money
>>> they
>>> stand to make. Itıs quite simple, actuallyŠalways follow the money. In
>>> yesteryear, there was only one format at a time. Now, formats change
>>> with the
>>> weather and producers/rights holders want paid for the same ³art
>>> work/intellectual property² with each format change. If they can
>>> convince the
>>> worldŠand the lawŠthat they need paid for each change, itıs in their
>>> best
>>> interest to demand such recompense and try to keep the law on their
>>> side. Of
>>> course, that means we, as in anyone who purchasesŠor are FORCED to
>>> purchase
>>> due to format retirementŠmust ante up for each format change. Those who
>>> sell,
>>> want as much as they can get for their waresŠand those who buy, wish to
>>> pay as
>>> little as possible for those same wares.
>>>
>>> Itıs a damn good thing we donıt have to buy lumber this way. Youıd buy a
>>> piece
>>> of wood to build a house. Thatıs OKŠthose rights were secured at the
>>> time of
>>> purchase. But when you try to use it to build a picnic table, you need
>>> to
>>> repurchase the rights because thatıs a format change. Imagine the
>>> trouble if
>>> you then sold that transformative work. The wood was originally sold to
>>> build
>>> a house, but now itıs used as a table!Šletıs not go there right now.
>>> Now, when
>>> you wish to also build a bird house, you need to purchase rights
>>> againŠwhy?...format change!. When youıre done with the bird house and
>>> you burn
>>> it, be careful!...thatıs also a format change, but itıs a grey area and
>>> weıd
>>> need to get a lawyer, or maybe an exemption to the Library of Wood
>>> Products.
>>> After itıs all been said, itıs still a piece of wood, once a tree, and
>>> when
>>> the forester cut down that tree, it was his intent for it to be a house
>>> and
>>> that was his work and he wanted it to be a house, and by damned, he
>>> should
>>> have gotten paid again, when it became a picnic table, and again when it
>>> became a bird house, and even when it was used as heat. How absurd!
>>>
>>> Iım lookin forward to Friday!
>>>
>>> Mark
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Mark W. Kopp
>>> Technology Assistant
>>> IT Department
>>> Appalachia Intermediate Unit 8
>>> 4500 6th Avenue
>>> Altoona, PA 16602
>>> P: 814-940-0223
>>> F: 814-949-0984
>>> C: 814-937-2802
>>>
>>> From: videolib-bounces@lists.berkeley.edu
>>> [mailto:videolib-bounces@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Anna Headley
>>> Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 9:13 AM
>>> To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
>>> Subject: Re: [Videolib] copyright AGAIN [Scanned]
>>>
>>> As I understand it:
>>> I can buy a DVD with PPR for the life of the product. Even if you stop
>>> selling that DVD, if I still have it and it still works, I still have
>>> those
>>> rights. What is the difference with a digital file?? It should be the
>>> same
>>> thing. You sell it to me, you send it to me, and I own it along with
>>> the
>>> rights until it's obsolete or broken. After a while, your ownership
>>> runs out
>>> and you can't sell it anymore. But that shouldn't affect the copy I
>>> already
>>> have. Please tell me what I'm missing.
>>> best,
>>> anna h.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Subject:
>>> Re: [Videolib] copyright AGAIN
>>> From:
>>> Jessica Rosner <jrosner@kino.com> <mailto:jrosner@kino.com>
>>> Date:
>>> Wed, 29 Oct 2008 11:55:01 -0400
>>> To:
>>> <videolib@lists.berkeley.edu> <mailto:videolib@lists.berkeley.edu>
>>>
>>>
>>> To:
>>> <videolib@lists.berkeley.edu> <mailto:videolib@lists.berkeley.edu>
>>>
>>>
>>> Well being almost totally ignorant of digital technology it is hard for
>>> me
>>> to say. If in fact this is a format with life span similar to VHS or DVd
>>> which small companies at least have and continue to sell with some kind
>>> of
>>> PPR rights it might work but I suspect that realistically you are
>>> really
>>> looking towards licensing with more specific time frame between say 1-5
>>> years.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 10/29/08 11:27 AM, "Brewer, Michael" <brewerm@u.library.arizona.edu>
>>> <mailto:brewerm@u.library.arizona.edu>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Proud Resident of a BLUE STATE
>>
>> Jessica Rosner
>> Kino International
>> 333 W 39th St. 503
>> NY NY 10018
>> jrosner@kino.com
>> 212-629-6880
>>
>> VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of
>> issues relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic
>> control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in
>> libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve
>> as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of
>> communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video
>> producers and distributors.
>>
>
>
> VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues
> relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control,
> preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and
> related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective
> working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication
> between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and
> distributors.
>
>

Proud Resident of a BLUE STATE

Jessica Rosner
Kino International
333 W 39th St. 503
NY NY 10018
jrosner@kino.com
212-629-6880

VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and distributors.