Re: [Videolib] copyright AGAIN [Scanned]

Mark Kopp (mkopp@iu08.org)
Thu, 30 Oct 2008 15:57:46 -0400

I believe they call it a "change of format"...CD's are out, and as always, it's up to those in the know, to gamble on the next big trend in media format. In the music biz, it's all about portability right now.

Mark W. Kopp
Technology Assistant
IT Department
Appalachia Intermediate Unit 8
4500 6th Avenue
Altoona, PA 16602
P: 814-940-0223
F: 814-949-0984
C: 814-937-2802
-----Original Message-----
From: videolib-bounces@lists.berkeley.edu [mailto:videolib-bounces@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Jerry Notaro
Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 12:05 PM
To: Jessica Rosner
Cc: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: [Videolib] copyright AGAIN [Scanned]

ALL businesses are merging and suffering massive cutbacks. Anyone in the
music business will tell you they would be in BIG trouble without online
content sales. Yes, cd sales are down, and now dvd sales are down. And
just as people have been plugging their iPods into cars, instead of
popping in cd's, there are iPod docking stations for televisions now. The
writing is on the wall.

Jerry

Jessica Rosner wrote:
> Um Mark
> Record companies are being KILLED, CD sales are off a cliff and the money
> they get from say iTunes is not close to covering it . Record companies
> are
> LOSING money for the most part , there have been massive cutbacks and
> mergers, it is anything but a thriving business and I think that is what
> Us distributors are very worried about. It should be noted that the music
> market is being destroyed more or less by individuals even those pirating
> on
> a big scale, schools on the other hand have made licensing deals in many
> cases which of course is what all of us would like if all those really big
> problems could be worked out.
>
>
> On 10/30/08 11:29 AM, "Jerry Notaro" <notaro@stpt.usf.edu> wrote:
>
>> I don't agree with Mark's analogy either, Jessica, but we have heard the
>> same argument you are presenting from record companies when people
>> started
>> streaming music. Buying and managing music online is a reality and the
>> rights and content holders are making tons of money because of it. If
>> they
>> would have stuck to selling music "only" on cd's, yes, they would be in
>> trouble, but that didn't happen and they are thriving. Much as producers
>> and distributors think librarians are trying to make a fast buck, it is
>> going to be survival mode soon for content providers. People are
>> demanding
>> it and yes, they will pass and choose other content because of the
>> format
>> available.
>>
>> Jerry
>>
>> Jessica Rosner wrote:
>>> More like you buy a house on the water in an area zoned for residential
>>> use
>>> only, but you decide you can
>>> Make a bundle by tearing it down and building a 5 story hotel and
>>> allowing
>>> hundreds of folks to the water.
>>> You are sued because YOU VIOLATED the law that said the property was
>>> for
>>> residential use ONLY.
>>>
>>> You want to take material marked for home use ( Films) for which a
>>> generous
>>> exemption already exists allowing you to
>>> Use them in ³Face to face² teaching instruction IN the class with the
>>> instructor present , rip them off again LITERALLY by breaking
>>> encryption
>>> which is unequivocally against the law except for CLIPS for film
>>> classes,
>>> digitize and stream them so that students can watch them anywhere they
>>> find
>>> ³convenient².
>>>
>>> As per previous post I hope you wont mind when after all the small film
>>> distributors are gone because we could not sell
>>> 50 copies of a film a rare film we spent $30,000 to get out ( and that
>>> is
>>> for a REALLY cheap one) to universities , the schools decide there is
>>> no
>>> need for librarians now that Mega Distributor corp. of America offers
>>> schools one stop shopping where
>>> ALL FILMS AND BOOKS are digitized and you only pay them a few thousand
>>> bucks
>>> a year to give your campus access to
>>> All of it.. Keep in mind Mega distributors has of course Merely bought
>>> one
>>> copy of the film or book , digitized it and made it available to any
>>> campus
>>> that subscribes to it¹s service After all the copy they bought for $
>>> 14.98
>>> from Baker & Taylor was a LEGAL copy so the school didn¹t even have to
>>> buy
>>> that one. No need for rights or librarians, think of the money they
>>> can
>>> save.
>>> This is the logical conclusion of taking copyrighted material
>>> ,digitizing
>>> & streaming it why would any budget conscience
>>> Institution do otherwise ?
>>>
>>>
>>> On 10/30/08 10:55 AM, "Mark Kopp" <mkopp@iu08.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> The most important term in your commentŠ²should²
>>>>
>>>> And on the other side of your ³should², some producer/rights holder is
>>>> claiming they ³should² get paid every single time someone views their
>>>> stuff.
>>>> It¹s the very reason they want the law to prevent us from tampering
>>>> with
>>>> the
>>>> ³technological measures². The less exemptions there are, the more
>>>> money
>>>> they
>>>> stand to make. It¹s quite simple, actuallyŠalways follow the money. In
>>>> yesteryear, there was only one format at a time. Now, formats change
>>>> with the
>>>> weather and producers/rights holders want paid for the same ³art
>>>> work/intellectual property² with each format change. If they can
>>>> convince the
>>>> worldŠand the lawŠthat they need paid for each change, it¹s in their
>>>> best
>>>> interest to demand such recompense and try to keep the law on their
>>>> side. Of
>>>> course, that means we, as in anyone who purchasesŠor are FORCED to
>>>> purchase
>>>> due to format retirementŠmust ante up for each format change. Those
>>>> who
>>>> sell,
>>>> want as much as they can get for their waresŠand those who buy, wish
>>>> to
>>>> pay as
>>>> little as possible for those same wares.
>>>>
>>>> It¹s a damn good thing we don¹t have to buy lumber this way. You¹d buy
>>>> a
>>>> piece
>>>> of wood to build a house. That¹s OKŠthose rights were secured at the
>>>> time of
>>>> purchase. But when you try to use it to build a picnic table, you need
>>>> to
>>>> repurchase the rights because that¹s a format change. Imagine the
>>>> trouble if
>>>> you then sold that transformative work. The wood was originally sold
>>>> to
>>>> build
>>>> a house, but now it¹s used as a table!Šlet¹s not go there right now.
>>>> Now, when
>>>> you wish to also build a bird house, you need to purchase rights
>>>> againŠwhy?...format change!. When you¹re done with the bird house and
>>>> you burn
>>>> it, be careful!...that¹s also a format change, but it¹s a grey area
>>>> and
>>>> we¹d
>>>> need to get a lawyer, or maybe an exemption to the Library of Wood
>>>> Products.
>>>> After it¹s all been said, it¹s still a piece of wood, once a tree, and
>>>> when
>>>> the forester cut down that tree, it was his intent for it to be a
>>>> house
>>>> and
>>>> that was his work and he wanted it to be a house, and by damned, he
>>>> should
>>>> have gotten paid again, when it became a picnic table, and again when
>>>> it
>>>> became a bird house, and even when it was used as heat. How absurd!
>>>>
>>>> I¹m lookin forward to Friday!
>>>>
>>>> Mark
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Mark W. Kopp
>>>> Technology Assistant
>>>> IT Department
>>>> Appalachia Intermediate Unit 8
>>>> 4500 6th Avenue
>>>> Altoona, PA 16602
>>>> P: 814-940-0223
>>>> F: 814-949-0984
>>>> C: 814-937-2802
>>>>
>>>> From: videolib-bounces@lists.berkeley.edu
>>>> [mailto:videolib-bounces@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Anna Headley
>>>> Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 9:13 AM
>>>> To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
>>>> Subject: Re: [Videolib] copyright AGAIN [Scanned]
>>>>
>>>> As I understand it:
>>>> I can buy a DVD with PPR for the life of the product. Even if you
>>>> stop
>>>> selling that DVD, if I still have it and it still works, I still have
>>>> those
>>>> rights. What is the difference with a digital file?? It should be
>>>> the
>>>> same
>>>> thing. You sell it to me, you send it to me, and I own it along with
>>>> the
>>>> rights until it's obsolete or broken. After a while, your ownership
>>>> runs out
>>>> and you can't sell it anymore. But that shouldn't affect the copy I
>>>> already
>>>> have. Please tell me what I'm missing.
>>>> best,
>>>> anna h.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Subject:
>>>> Re: [Videolib] copyright AGAIN
>>>> From:
>>>> Jessica Rosner <jrosner@kino.com> <mailto:jrosner@kino.com>
>>>> Date:
>>>> Wed, 29 Oct 2008 11:55:01 -0400
>>>> To:
>>>> <videolib@lists.berkeley.edu> <mailto:videolib@lists.berkeley.edu>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> To:
>>>> <videolib@lists.berkeley.edu> <mailto:videolib@lists.berkeley.edu>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Well being almost totally ignorant of digital technology it is hard
>>>> for
>>>> me
>>>> to say. If in fact this is a format with life span similar to VHS or
>>>> DVd
>>>> which small companies at least have and continue to sell with some
>>>> kind
>>>> of
>>>> PPR rights it might work but I suspect that realistically you are
>>>> really
>>>> looking towards licensing with more specific time frame between say
>>>> 1-5
>>>> years.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 10/29/08 11:27 AM, "Brewer, Michael"
>>>> <brewerm@u.library.arizona.edu>
>>>> <mailto:brewerm@u.library.arizona.edu>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Proud Resident of a BLUE STATE
>>>
>>> Jessica Rosner
>>> Kino International
>>> 333 W 39th St. 503
>>> NY NY 10018
>>> jrosner@kino.com
>>> 212-629-6880
>>>
>>> VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of
>>> issues relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic
>>> control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in
>>> libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will
>>> serve
>>> as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel
>>> of
>>> communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video
>>> producers and distributors.
>>>
>>
>>
>> VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of
>> issues
>> relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic
>> control,
>> preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries
>> and
>> related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an
>> effective
>> working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication
>> between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and
>> distributors.
>>
>>
>
>
>
> Proud Resident of a BLUE STATE
>
> Jessica Rosner
> Kino International
> 333 W 39th St. 503
> NY NY 10018
> jrosner@kino.com
> 212-629-6880
>
>
>
>

VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and distributors.

VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and distributors.