Re: [Videolib] copyright AGAIN [Scanned]

Jessica Rosner (jrosner@kino.com)
Thu, 30 Oct 2008 11:08:21 -0400

> This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.

--===============8496325027671418731==
Content-type: multipart/alternative;
boundary="B_3308209705_14189995"

> This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.

--B_3308209705_14189995
Content-type: text/plain;
charset="ISO-8859-1"
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable

More like you buy a house on the water in an area zoned for residential use
only, but you decide you can
Make a bundle by tearing it down and building a 5 story hotel and allowing
hundreds of folks to the water.
You are sued because YOU VIOLATED the law that said the property was for
residential use ONLY.

You want to take material marked for home use ( Films) for which a generous
exemption already exists allowing you to
Use them in =B3Face to face=B2 teaching instruction IN the class with the
instructor present , rip them off again LITERALLY by breaking encryption
which is unequivocally against the law except for CLIPS for film classes,
digitize and stream them so that students can watch them anywhere they find
=B3convenient=B2. =20

As per previous post I hope you wont mind when after all the small film
distributors are gone because we could not sell
50 copies of a film a rare film we spent $30,000 to get out ( and that is
for a REALLY cheap one) to universities , the schools decide there is no
need for librarians now that Mega Distributor corp. of America offers
schools one stop shopping where
ALL FILMS AND BOOKS are digitized and you only pay them a few thousand buck=
s
a year to give your campus access to
All of it.. Keep in mind Mega distributors has of course Merely bought one
copy of the film or book , digitized it and made it available to any campus
that subscribes to it=B9s service After all the copy they bought for $ 14.98
from Baker & Taylor was a LEGAL copy so the school didn=B9t even have to buy
that one. No need for rights or librarians, think of the money they can
save.
This is the logical conclusion of taking copyrighted material ,digitizing
& streaming it why would any budget conscience
Institution do otherwise ?

On 10/30/08 10:55 AM, "Mark Kopp" <mkopp@iu08.org> wrote:

> The most important term in your comment=8A=B2should=B2
> =20
> And on the other side of your =B3should=B2, some producer/rights holder is
> claiming they =B3should=B2 get paid every single time someone views their stu=
ff.
> It=B9s the very reason they want the law to prevent us from tampering with =
the
> =B3technological measures=B2. The less exemptions there are, the more money t=
hey
> stand to make. It=B9s quite simple, actually=8Aalways follow the money. In
> yesteryear, there was only one format at a time. Now, formats change with=
the
> weather and producers/rights holders want paid for the same =B3art
> work/intellectual property=B2 with each format change. If they can convince=
the
> world=8Aand the law=8Athat they need paid for each change, it=B9s in their best
> interest to demand such recompense and try to keep the law on their side.=
Of
> course, that means we, as in anyone who purchases=8Aor are FORCED to purcha=
se
> due to format retirement=8Amust ante up for each format change. Those who s=
ell,
> want as much as they can get for their wares=8Aand those who buy, wish to p=
ay as
> little as possible for those same wares.
> =20
> It=B9s a damn good thing we don=B9t have to buy lumber this way. You=B9d buy a =
piece
> of wood to build a house. That=B9s OK=8Athose rights were secured at the time=
of
> purchase. But when you try to use it to build a picnic table, you need to
> repurchase the rights because that=B9s a format change. Imagine the trouble=
if
> you then sold that transformative work. The wood was originally sold to b=
uild
> a house, but now it=B9s used as a table!=8Alet=B9s not go there right now. Now,=
when
> you wish to also build a bird house, you need to purchase rights
> again=8Awhy?...format change!. When you=B9re done with the bird house and you=
burn
> it, be careful!...that=B9s also a format change, but it=B9s a grey area and w=
e=B9d
> need to get a lawyer, or maybe an exemption to the Library of Wood Produc=
ts.
> After it=B9s all been said, it=B9s still a piece of wood, once a tree, and wh=
en
> the forester cut down that tree, it was his intent for it to be a house a=
nd
> that was his work and he wanted it to be a house, and by damned, he shoul=
d
> have gotten paid again, when it became a picnic table, and again when it
> became a bird house, and even when it was used as heat. How absurd!
> =20
> I=B9m lookin forward to Friday!
> =20
> Mark
> =20
> =20
>=20
> Mark W. Kopp
> Technology Assistant
> IT Department
> Appalachia Intermediate Unit 8
> 4500 6th Avenue
> Altoona, PA 16602
> P: 814-940-0223
> F: 814-949-0984
> C: 814-937-2802
>=20
> From: videolib-bounces@lists.berkeley.edu
> [mailto:videolib-bounces@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Anna Headley
> Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 9:13 AM
> To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
> Subject: Re: [Videolib] copyright AGAIN [Scanned]
> =20
> As I understand it:
> I can buy a DVD with PPR for the life of the product. Even if you stop
> selling that DVD, if I still have it and it still works, I still have tho=
se
> rights. What is the difference with a digital file?? It should be the s=
ame
> thing. You sell it to me, you send it to me, and I own it along with the
> rights until it's obsolete or broken. After a while, your ownership runs=
out
> and you can't sell it anymore. But that shouldn't affect the copy I alre=
ady
> have. Please tell me what I'm missing.
> best,
> anna h.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> =20
> Subject: =20
> Re: [Videolib] copyright AGAIN
> From: =20
> Jessica Rosner <jrosner@kino.com> <mailto:jrosner@kino.com>
> Date: =20
> Wed, 29 Oct 2008 11:55:01 -0400
> To: =20
> <videolib@lists.berkeley.edu> <mailto:videolib@lists.berkeley.edu>
> =20
> =20
> To: =20
> <videolib@lists.berkeley.edu> <mailto:videolib@lists.berkeley.edu>
>=20
>=20
> Well being almost totally ignorant of digital technology it is hard for =
me
> to say. If in fact this is a format with life span similar to VHS or DVd
> which small companies at least have and continue to sell with some kind o=
f
> PPR rights it might work but I suspect that realistically you are really
> looking towards licensing with more specific time frame between say 1-5
> years.
> =20
> =20
> On 10/29/08 11:27 AM, "Brewer, Michael" <brewerm@u.library.arizona.edu>
> <mailto:brewerm@u.library.arizona.edu>
> wrote:
> =20
>=20

Proud Resident of a BLUE STATE
=20
Jessica Rosner
Kino International
333 W 39th St. 503
NY NY 10018
jrosner@kino.com
212-629-6880

--B_3308209705_14189995
Content-type: text/html;
charset="ISO-8859-1"
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable

Re: [Videolib] copyright AGAIN [Scanned] More like you buy a house on the water in an area zoned for residential us= e only, but you decide you can
Make a bundle by tearing it down and building a 5 story hotel and allowing = hundreds of folks to the water.
You are sued because YOU VIOLATED the law that said the property was for re= sidential use ONLY.  

You want to take material marked for home use ( Films) for which a generous= exemption already exists allowing you to
Use them in  “Face to face” teaching instruction IN  = the class with the instructor present , rip them off again LITERALLY by brea= king encryption which is unequivocally against the law except for CLIPS for = film classes, digitize and stream them so that students can watch them anywh= ere they find “convenient”.  

As per previous post I hope you wont mind when after all the small film dis= tributors are gone because we could not sell
50 copies of a film a rare film we spent $30,000 to  get out ( and tha= t is for a REALLY cheap one) to universities , the schools decide there is n= o need for librarians now that Mega Distributor corp. of America offers scho= ols one stop shopping where
ALL FILMS AND BOOKS are digitized and you only pay them a few thousand buck= s a year  to give your campus access to
All of it.. Keep in mind Mega distributors has of course Merely bought one = copy of the film or book , digitized it and made it available to any campus = that subscribes to it’s service After all the copy they bought for $ 1= 4.98 from Baker & Taylor was a LEGAL copy so the school didn’t eve= n have to buy that one.  No need for rights or librarians, think of the= money they can save.
This is the logical  conclusion of taking copyrighted material ,digiti= zing  & streaming it  why would  any budget conscience Institution do otherwise ?


On 10/30/08 10:55 AM, "Mark Kopp" <mk= opp@iu08.org> wrote:

= The most important term in your comment…&= #8221;should”
 
And on the other side of your “should”, some producer/rights ho= lder is claiming they “should” get paid every single time someon= e views their stuff. It’s the very reason they want the law to prevent= us from tampering with the “technological measures”. The less e= xemptions there are, the more money they stand to make. It’s quite sim= ple, actually…always follow the money. In yesteryear, there was only o= ne format at a time. Now, formats change with the weather and producers/righ= ts holders want paid for the same “art work/intellectual property̶= 1; with each format change. If they can convince the world…and the law= …that they need paid for each change, it’s in their best interes= t to demand such recompense and try to keep the law on their side. Of course= , that means we, as in anyone who purchases…or are FORCED to purchase = due to format retirement…must ante up for each format change. Those wh= o sell, want as much as they can get for their wares…and those who buy= , wish to pay as little as possible for those same wares.
 
It’s a damn good thing we don’t have to buy lumber this way. Yo= u’d buy a piece of wood to build a house. That’s OK…those = rights were secured at the time of purchase. But when you try to use it to b= uild a picnic table, you need to repurchase the rights because that’s = a format change. Imagine the trouble if you then sold that transformative wo= rk. The wood was originally sold to build a house, but now it’s used a= s a table!…let’s not go there right now. Now, when you wish to a= lso build a bird house, you need to purchase rights again…why?...forma= t change!. When you’re done with the bird house and you burn it, be ca= reful!...that’s also a format change, but it’s a grey area and w= e’d need to get a lawyer, or maybe an exemption to the Library of Wood= Products. After it’s all been said, it’s still a piece of wood,= once a tree, and when the forester cut down that tree, it was his intent fo= r it to be a house and that was his work and he wanted it to be a house, and= by damned, he should have gotten paid again, when it became a picnic table,= and again when it became a bird house, and even when it was used as heat. H= ow absurd!
 
I’m lookin forward to Friday!
 
Mark
 
 

Mark W. Kopp
Technology Assistant<= BR> IT Department
Appalachia Intermediate Unit 8
4500 6th Avenue
Altoona, PA  16602
P: 814-940-0223
F: 814-949-0984
C: 814-937-2802

From: videolib-bounces@lists.berkeley.edu [mailto:videolib-bounces@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Anna Headley
Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 9:13 AM
To:
videolib@lists.berkeley.ed= u
Subject: Re: [Videolib] copyright AGAIN [Scanned]

As I understand it:
I can buy a DVD with PPR for the life of the product.  Even if you sto= p selling that DVD, if I still have it and it still works, I still have thos= e rights.  What is the difference with a digital file??  It should= be the same thing.  You sell it to me, you send it to me, and I own it= along with the rights until it's obsolete or broken.  After a while, y= our ownership runs out and you can't sell it anymore.  But that shouldn= 't affect the copy I already have.  Please tell me what I'm missing. best,
anna h.




   
Subject:
 
Re: [Videolib] copyright AGAIN   
   
From:
 
Jessica Rosner <jrosner@kino.com> &l= t;mailto:jrosner@kino.com> <= /FONT>   
   
Date:
 
Wed, 29 Oct 2008 11:55:01 -0400   
   
To:
 
<videolib@lists.berkeley.edu= > <mailto:videolib@lists.= berkeley.edu>  

   
To:
 
<videolib@lists.berkeley.edu= > <mailto:videolib@lists.= berkeley.edu>  

Well  being almost totally ignorant of digital technolo= gy it is hard for me
to say. If in fact this is a format with life span similar to VHS or DVd which small companies at least have and continue to sell with some kind of<= BR> PPR rights  it might work but I suspect that realistically you are rea= lly
looking towards licensing with more specific time frame between say 1-5
years.
 
 
On 10/29/08 11:27 AM, "Brewer, Michael" <brewerm@u.library.arizona.edu> <mailto:brewerm@u.library.arizona.edu>=
wrote:
  



Proud Resident of a BLUE STATE
 
Jessica Rosner
Kino International
333 W 39th St. 503
NY NY 10018
jrosner@kino.com
212-629-6880

--B_3308209705_14189995--

--===============8496325027671418731==
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline

VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and distributors.

--===============8496325027671418731==--