RE: [Videolib] The meaning of "distance education"

Christine Godin (diractor@yahoo.com)
Wed, 27 Jun 2007 11:58:05 -0700 (PDT)

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An overarching issue is that the accrediting agencies with which we deal usually demand equal access and availability to resources for all students. After all, most of them pay all the same fees, regardless of whether or not they take advantage of various services.

They might be putting us in a bind by demanding that we live up to a promise we cannot make.

"Brewer, Michael" <brewerm@u.library.arizona.edu> wrote:
There are few restrictions actually put on Fair Use in the law. Only
examples are provided. Guidelines have been drawn up for various uses,
but they are guidelines only. We have some case law to look at as well,
but that, too, is all over the place as far as the context and types of
uses. Streaming for these purposes is a new area that has not really
been looked at and I think we can all agree that TEACH has been a
failure.

I think we need to depart from TEACH and begin discussing what sorts of
uses we feel are fair as far as digital delivery for course use. I do
think that nothing here is terribly clear and that the effect on the
market for the content has to be looked at very closely. The relative
"fairness" of a current use could easily change in the future as more
content providers create solid business models for licensing and
delivering content for these educational purposes.

mb

Michael Brewer

Slavic Studies, German Studies & Media Arts Librarian

University of Arizona Library

brewerm@u.library.arizona.edu

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
[mailto:owner-videolib@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of Jessica Rosner
Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 10:01 AM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: [Videolib] The meaning of "distance education"

Well "Fair Use" has it's own separate restrictions . I don't think it
has a
ton of relevance to streaming & downloading material since you would
most
likely have issues with using more than a portion of a work and
impacting
its commercial value but I suppose one could come up with some scenarios
under which it could apply and be useful
What matters most to me is that both Distance Education and Fair Use
clearly
forbid the use of lengthy works like my beloved feature films. I think
if
you go to both IUPIPI and NCSU copyright web sites you will find pretty
detailed info on both uses and limitations of "Fair Use" and The Teach
Act.

On 6/27/07 12:22 PM, "Brewer, Michael"

wrote:

> I remain unconvinced that TEACH restricts to synchronous (but
distance)
> teaching (but am still quite willing to listen to an argument based on
the
> text of the law). That said, I'm not sure that it really matters. I
firmly
> believe that one can make a strong fair use claim for the kind of uses
that
> are being talked about below. If there are those in libraries that
believe
> otherwise, I'd like to hear their reasoning as to why these uses would
not be
> fair.
>
> mb
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: owner-videolib@lists.berkeley.edu on behalf of Gary Handman
> Sent: Wed 6/27/2007 8:08 AM
> To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
> Subject: Re: [Videolib] The meaning of "distance education"
>
>
>
> you go, girl!
>
> Gary
>
>
> At 06:58 AM 6/27/2007, you wrote:
>> X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.3
>> X-Modus-BlackList: 198.86.245.216=OK;cmhealy@waketech.edu=OK
>> X-Modus-Trusted: 198.86.245.216=YES
>> X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 7.0
>> Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2007 09:58:16 -0400
>> From: "Ciara Healy"
>> To: "videolib@lists.berkeley.edu"
>> Subject: Re: [Videolib] The meaning of "distance education"
>> X-Ucb-Scan-Signature: db6d6a1bec3f414eb93f42a87d6f2177a02457ec
>> X-Ucb-Spam: Gauge=IIIIIII, Probability=7%, Report=''
>> X-Ucb-Notice: This message has been processed by a spam tagging
system.
>> See http://mailinfo.berkeley.edu/ for more information.
>> Sender: owner-videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
>> Reply-To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
>>
>> For the film distributors among us rather than the people who work at
>> colleges:
>>
>> Please note the difference between synchronous and asynchronous
>> distance education. In asynchronous education students never come to
the
>> campus and may take the class from any where (geographically
speaking)
>> but there is no specified class meeting time where they would all
watch
>> parts of a movie together via their respective computers. So an
>> asynchronous class via, say, Blackboard does not have the option to
use
>> downloaded media according to the TEACH act on this interpretation
>> because the class is not meeting in real time? Some downloaded visual
or
>> audio materials would not be supplemental like reserve items. They
would
>> be part of the curriculum for an asynchronous distance education
class.
>> It is also the case that those kinds of classes delivered via
>> Blackboard, might want to put things on reserve as well that are
>> supplemental to the current module or discussion. They too would not
>> have the right to make media available for download on this
>> interpretation, according to Dr.Crews. That pretty much knocks out
the
>> instructor at my college who teaches music appreciation and wants his
>> class to be fully hybrid but is asking me to help him deliver music
and
>> parts of Ken Burns' Jazz series to his students via Blackboard. (He
is
>> BFF with the Distance Education Lady.) It knocks them all out in fact
>> because we all only use Blackboard here. Asynchronously.
>>
>> If the TEACH act was formulated with the definition of distance
>> education as a synchronous teaching/learning during a certain class
>> meeting via computer, then that happens less than you might think.
>>
>> A lot more classes are these asynchronous things where it is more
like
>> a correspondence course or a self-paced class that you take on you
own
>> with all of the course materials found on the Blackboard (or Web CT
or
>> whatever) site at once or put up successively each week. Contact with
>> the instructor is via e-mail (asynchronous) or sometimes live chat
>> (synchronous) or you could call them on the phone (synchronous) but
>> usually it is just via the discussion boards (asynchronous) on the
>> Blackboard site. (Blackboard is password protected and available to
only
>> the students enrolled in that class. Print material can be downloaded
or
>> persistent links to articles are provided to supplement the
textbook.)
>> VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of
>> issues relating to the selection, evaluation,
acquisition,bibliographic
>> control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats
in
>> libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will
serve
>> as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a
channel of
>> communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video
>> producers and distributors.
>
> Gary Handman
> Director
> Media Resources Center
> Moffitt Library
> UC Berkeley
> ghandman@library.berkeley.edu
> http://www.lib.berkeley.edu/MRC
>
> "In societies where modern conditions of production prevail, all of
life
> presents itself as an immense accumulation of spectacles."
>
> --Guy Debord
>
> VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of
issues
> relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic
control,
> preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in
libraries and
> related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an
effective
> working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of
communication
> between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and
> distributors.
>
>
>
> VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of
issues
> relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic
control,
> preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in
libraries and
> related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an
effective
> working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of
communication
> between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and
> distributors.

Proud Resident of a BLUE STATE

Jessica Rosner
Kino International
333 W 39th St. 503
NY NY 10018
jrosner@kino.com
212-629-6880

VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of
issues relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic
control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in
libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve
as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel
of communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video
producers and distributors.

VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and distributors.

Christine Godin
GO SPURS GO !!


---------------------------------
Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us.
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<div>An overarching issue is that the accrediting agencies with which we deal usually demand equal access and availability to resources for all students. After all, most of them pay all the same fees, regardless of whether or not they take advantage of various services.</div> <div>&nbsp;</div> <div>They might be putting us in a bind by demanding that we live up to a promise we cannot make.&nbsp; <BR><BR><B><I>"Brewer, Michael" &lt;brewerm@u.library.arizona.edu&gt;</I></B> wrote:</div> <BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">There are few restrictions actually put on Fair Use in the law. Only<BR>examples are provided. Guidelines have been drawn up for various uses,<BR>but they are guidelines only. We have some case law to look at as well,<BR>but that, too, is all over the place as far as the context and types of<BR>uses. Streaming for these purposes is a new area that has not really<BR>been looked at and I think
we can all agree that TEACH has been a<BR>failure. <BR><BR>I think we need to depart from TEACH and begin discussing what sorts of<BR>uses we feel are fair as far as digital delivery for course use. I do<BR>think that nothing here is terribly clear and that the effect on the<BR>market for the content has to be looked at very closely. The relative<BR>"fairness" of a current use could easily change in the future as more<BR>content providers create solid business models for licensing and<BR>delivering content for these educational purposes. <BR><BR>mb<BR><BR>Michael Brewer<BR><BR>Slavic Studies, German Studies &amp; Media Arts Librarian<BR><BR>University of Arizona Library <BR><BR>brewerm@u.library.arizona.edu<BR><BR><BR>-----Original Message-----<BR>From: owner-videolib@lists.berkeley.edu<BR>[mailto:owner-videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
meaning of "distance education"<BR><BR>Well "Fair Use" has it's own separate restrictions . I don't think it<BR>has a<BR>ton of relevance to streaming &amp; downloading material since you would<BR>most<BR>likely have issues with using more than a portion of a work and<BR>impacting<BR>its commercial value but I suppose one could come up with some scenarios<BR>under which it could apply and be useful<BR>What matters most to me is that both Distance Education and Fair Use<BR>clearly<BR>forbid the use of lengthy works like my beloved feature films. I think<BR>if<BR>you go to both IUPIPI and NCSU copyright web sites you will find pretty<BR>detailed info on both uses and limitations of "Fair Use" and The Teach<BR>Act.<BR><BR><BR>On 6/27/07 12:22 PM, "Brewer, Michael" <BREWERM@U.LIBRARY.ARIZONA.EDU><BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I remain unconvinced that TEACH restricts to synchronous (but<BR>distance)<BR>&gt; teaching (but am still quite willing to listen to an argument based
on<BR>the<BR>&gt; text of the law). That said, I'm not sure that it really matters. I<BR>firmly<BR>&gt; believe that one can make a strong fair use claim for the kind of uses<BR>that<BR>&gt; are being talked about below. If there are those in libraries that<BR>believe<BR>&gt; otherwise, I'd like to hear their reasoning as to why these uses would<BR>not be<BR>&gt; fair. <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; mb<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; ________________________________<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; From: owner-videolib@lists.berkeley.edu on behalf of Gary Handman<BR>&gt; Sent: Wed 6/27/2007 8:08 AM<BR>&gt; To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: [Videolib] The meaning of "distance education"<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; you go, girl!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Gary<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; At 06:58 AM 6/27/2007, you wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.3<BR>&gt;&gt; X-Modus-BlackList: 198.86.245.216=OK;cmhealy@waketech.edu=OK<BR>&gt;&gt; X-Modus-Trusted: 198.86.245.216=YES<BR>&gt;&gt; X-Mailer: Novell
GroupWise Internet Agent 7.0<BR>&gt;&gt; Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2007 09:58:16 -0400<BR>&gt;&gt; From: "Ciara Healy" <CMHEALY@WAKETECH.EDU><BR>&gt;&gt; To: "videolib@lists.berkeley.edu" <VIDEOLIB@LISTS.BERKELEY.EDU><BR>&gt;&gt; Subject: Re: [Videolib] The meaning of "distance education"<BR>&gt;&gt; X-Ucb-Scan-Signature: db6d6a1bec3f414eb93f42a87d6f2177a02457ec<BR>&gt;&gt; X-Ucb-Spam: Gauge=IIIIIII, Probability=7%, Report=''<BR>&gt;&gt; X-Ucb-Notice: This message has been processed by a spam tagging<BR>system.<BR>&gt;&gt; See http://mailinfo.berkeley.edu/ for more information.<BR>&gt;&gt; Sender: owner-videolib@lists.berkeley.edu<BR>&gt;&gt; Reply-To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; For the film distributors among us rather than the people who w
campus and may take the class from any where (geographically<BR>speaking)<BR>&gt;&gt; but there is no specified class meeting time where they would all<BR>watch<BR>&gt;&gt; parts of a movie together via their respective computers. So an<BR>&gt;&gt; asynchronous class via, say, Blackboard does not have the option to<BR>use<BR>&gt;&gt; downloaded media according to the TEACH act on this interpretation<BR>&gt;&gt; because the class is not meeting in real time? Some downloaded visual<BR>or<BR>&gt;&gt; audio materials would not be supplemental like reserve items. They<BR>would<BR>&gt;&gt; be part of the curriculum for an asynchronous distance education<BR>class.<BR>&gt;&gt; It is also the case that those kinds of classes delivered via<BR>&gt;&gt; Blackboard, might want to put things on reserve as well that are<BR>&gt;&gt; supplemental to the current module or discussion. They too would not<BR>&gt;&gt; have the right to make media available for download on this<BR>&gt;&gt;
interpretation, according to Dr.Crews. That pretty much knocks out<BR>the<BR>&gt;&gt; instructor at my college who teaches music appreciation and wants his<BR>&gt;&gt; class to be fully hybrid but is asking me to help him deliver music<BR>and<BR>&gt;&gt; parts of Ken Burns' Jazz series to his students via Blackboard. (He<BR>is<BR>&gt;&gt; BFF with the Distance Education Lady.) It knocks them all out in fact<BR>&gt;&gt; because we all only use Blackboard here. Asynchronously.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; If the TEACH act was formulated with the definition of distance<BR>&gt;&gt; education as a synchronous teaching/learning during a certain class<BR>&gt;&gt; meeting via computer, then that happens less than you might think.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; A lot more classes are these asynchronous things where it is more<BR>like<BR>&gt;&gt; a correspondence course or a self-paced class that you take on you<BR>own<BR>&gt;&gt; with all of the course materials found on the Blackboard (or
Web CT<BR>or<BR>&gt;&gt; whatever) site at once or put up successively each week. Contact with<BR>&gt;&gt; the instructor is via e-mail (asynchronous) or sometimes live chat<BR>&gt;&gt; (synchronous) or you could call them on the phone (synchronous) but<BR>&gt;&gt; usually it is just via the discussion boards (asynchronous) on the<BR>&gt;&gt; Blackboard site. (Blackboard is password protected and available to<BR>only<BR>&gt;&gt; the students enrolled in that class. Print material can be downloaded<BR>or<BR>&gt;&gt; persistent links to articles are provided to supplement the<BR>textbook.)<BR>&gt;&gt; VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of<BR>&gt;&gt; issues relating to the selection, evaluation,<BR>acquisition,bibliographic<BR>&gt;&gt; control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats<BR>in<BR>&gt;&gt; libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will<BR>serve<BR>&gt;&gt; as an effective working tool for
video librarians, as well as a<BR>channel of<BR>&gt;&gt; communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video<BR>&gt;&gt; producers and distributors.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Gary Handman<BR>&gt; Director<BR>&gt; Media Resources Center<BR>&gt; Moffitt Library<BR>&gt; UC Berkeley<BR>&gt; ghandman@library.berkeley.edu<BR>&gt; http://www.lib.berkeley.edu/MRC<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; "In societies where modern conditions of production prevail, all of<BR>life<BR>&gt; presents itself as an immense accumulation of spectacles."<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; --Guy Debord<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of<BR>issues<BR>&gt; relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic<BR>control,<BR
of<BR>communication<BR>&gt; between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and<BR>&gt; distributors.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of<BR>issues<BR>&gt; relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic<BR>control,<BR>&gt; preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in<BR>libraries and<BR>&gt; related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an<BR>effective<BR>&gt; working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of<BR>communication<BR>&gt; between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and<BR>&gt; distributors.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Proud Resident of a BLUE STATE<BR><BR>Jessica Rosner<BR>Kino International<BR>333 W 39th St. 503<BR>NY NY 10018<BR>jrosner@kino.com<BR>212-629-6880<BR><BR><BR>VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of<BR>issues relating to the selection, evaluation,
acquisition,bibliographic<BR>control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in<BR>libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve<BR>as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel<BR>of communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video<BR>producers and distributors.<BR><BR>VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and distributors.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR><BR><DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#407f00>Christine Godin</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face="Comic Sans
MS" color=#8000ff>GO SPURS GO !!</FONT></STRONG></DIV></DIV><p>&#32;
<hr size=1>Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. <a href="http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48516/*http://surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7 ">Join Yahoo!'s user panel</a> and lay it on us.

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VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and distributors.