RE: [Videolib] off air recording and copyright[Scanned]

Mark Kopp (mkopp@iu08.org)
Tue, 1 Aug 2006 10:32:39 -0400

Ok then, M. Claire...they are guidelines (sorry, I didn't see Gary's
post last week that included said guidelines). What part of the
"guidelines" would one have an actual NEED to usurp and for what
purpose? Don't get me wrong. I want to use as much material as possible
with the highest level of convenience...BUT...what "activity" would you
wish to be allowed that doesn't fall within the "guidelines"...OTHER
THAN convenience? What is the significance of being part of the
Congressional Record, if Congress did not intend for the guidelines to
be followed? It sounds to me like Congress adopted a set of guidelines
to support passed legislation...have they've defined the use of the
materials based on the intent of the particular portion Copyright Act?

Mark W. Kopp
Technology Assistant
IT Department
Appalachia Intermediate Unit 8
4500 6th Avenue
Altoona, PA 16602
P: 814-940-0223
F: 814-949-0984
C: 814-937-2802
****************************************************

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
[mailto:owner-videolib@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of M. Claire
Stewart
Sent: Tuesday, August 01, 2006 9:47 AM
To: videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
Subject: RE: [Videolib] off air recording and copyright[Scanned]

Just so it's clear ... the guidelines Mark sent are still guidelines.
They are not legislation, despite having been read into the
Congressional Record. These are the same ones Gary sent to the list last
Thursday.

Claire

>Um in case I was not clear here. I never had a problem with the 45 day
>guidleine just the claim that off air copies were "legal" copies and
>could be used indefinately.
>
>I am in a severe depression today as the Cubs just traded the greatest

>baseball player of my lifetime ( Greg Maddux) so not clear thinking on
>that one
>
>However I do appreciate the post which makes it clear that the question

>that started this all ( A tape made BY a proffessor years ago) violated

>this legislation about
>6 different ways
>
>Off to very hot, very depressing Wrigley
>
>
>Quoting jrosner@kino.com:
>
>> Ok works for me
>> Thanks for the research
>>
>>
>> Quoting Mark Kopp <mkopp@iu08.org>:
>>
>> > I dunno...seems pretty clear to me...
>> > From: Congressional Record, October 14, 1984 > > Guidelines for
>> Off-Air Taping for Educational Purposes > (Kastenmeier Guidelines)
>> > > 1. The Guidelines were developed to appy only to off-air
>> recording by > non-profit educational institutions.
>> >
>> > 2. A broadcast program (including cable programs) may be recorded

>> > off-air and retained by a non-profit educational institution for a

>> > period not to exceed the first forty-five (45) consecutive calendar

>> days > after the date of recording.
>> >
>> > 3. Off-air recording may be used once by individual teachers in
>> the > course of relevant teaching activities, and repreated once
>> only when > instructional reinforcement is necessary in classrooms
>> and similar > places devoted to instruction within a single
>> building, cluster, or > campus, as well as in the homes of students
>> receiving formalized home > instruction, during the first ten (10)
>> consecutive schools days in the > forty-five (45) day calendar day
>> retention period. "School days" are > school session days--not
>> couting weekends, holidays, vacations, > examination periods, or
>> other scheduled interruptions--within the > forty-five (45) calendar
day retention period.
>> >
>> > 4. Off-air recordings may be made only at the request of and used
>> by > individual teachers, and may not be regularly recorded in
>> anticipation > of requests. No broadcast program may be recorded
>> off-air more than once > at the request of the same teacher,
>> regardless of the number of times > the program may be broadcast.
>> >
>> > 5. A limited number of copies may be reproduced from each off-air

>> > recording to meet the legitimate needs of teachers under these >
>> guidelines. Each additional copy shall be subject to all provisions
>> > governing the original recording.
>> >
>> > 6. After the first ten (10) consecutive schools days, off-air
>> recordings > may be used up to the end of the forty-five (45)
>> calendar day retention > period only for teacher evaluation
>> purposes. i.e., to determine whether > or not to include the
>> broadcast program in the teaching curriculum, and > may not be used
>> in the recording institution for student exhibition or > any other
non-evaluation purpose without authorization.
>> >
>> > 7. Off-air recordings need not be used in their entirety, but the

>> > recorded programs may not be altered from their original content.
>> > Off-air recordings may not be physically or electonically combined

>> or > merged to constitute teaching anthologies or compilations.
>> >
>> > 8. All copies of off-air recordings must include the copyright
>> notice on > the broadcast program as recorded.
>> >
>> > 9. Educational institutions are expected to establish appropriate

>> > control procedures to maintain the integrity of these guidelines.
>> >
>> > Congressional Record, October 14, 1984 > > > Mark W. Kopp >
>> Technology Assistant > IT Department > Appalachia Intermediate Unit

>> 8 > 4500 6th Avenue > Altoona, PA 16602
> > > P: 814-940-0223
>> > F: 814-949-0984
>> > C: 814-937-2802
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: owner-videolib@lists.berkeley.edu >
>> [mailto:owner-videolib@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of
>> jrosner@kino.com > Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 12:47 PM > To:
>> videolib@lists.berkeley.edu > Subject: RE: [Videolib] off air
>> recording and copyright[Scanned] > > Michael & Company > I guess I

>> am just about to lose it on this one.
>> > An off air copy is NOT legal and "fair use" has NOTHING to do with

>> it. I > am really getting tired of a small minority using anything
>> to justify > using program ,obtained in any manner because they are
>> an educational > instition and they want to.
>> > The previous poster used provisions of the section involving
>> making a > DUPLICATE OF LEGALLY OBTAINED copy if that copy is
>> detiorating and a > replacement is not avaialable and then MIXED it
with "Fair Use"
>> > I really think it is pointless to go over the concept that EVERY
>> case > EVER involving "fair use" and every site, even academic ones
>> explains > that "fair use" involves when you can use a PORTION of a
>> work as part of > ANOTHER work ( Transformative) I know Gary and
>> folks like to point out > that "portion " is only a factor but we
>> are dancing on the head of pin > here. Find me ANY copyright lawyer
>> up to and including the electronic > frontier folks who believe that

>> "fair use" would allow the use of an > entire work let alone the
>> entire work of an ILLEGAL COPY. Michael to > answer your specific
>> question as I pointed out earlier those guidlines > were I imagine
>> put in place to give educational institutions a little > leeway to
>> use what I suspect they thought of as educational related > material

>> for a short time but it is irrelevent because it is NOT in the >
>> copyright law and the copyright law ALWAYS requires material be a
legal > copy.
>> >
>> > Can we please,please have a little common sense here ( Gary???) If

>> you > want to make the arguement that "fair use" allows to use an
>> entire work > ( and show it to public audience per a previous
>> thread) I suggest you > get some legal back up but to argue that you

>> can tape ANYTHING off air > and is legal to use as long as you like
>> is just nuts. Still no one has > answered for me why you could not
>> use dupes of off air copies sold on > eBay etc. Tape every movie TCM

>> runs that is not released and put in your > collection etc.
>> >
>> > I think the arrogance that we just want to use what we want to use

>> and > if the rights holer has not made it legally available I am
>> going to get > it anyway I can is staggering. Basically you just
>> obliterate copyright > law and the rights of filmakers &
>> distributors "Sorry bud your film was > broadcast in 1995 on WOR and

>> I got a copy from my cousin so I can use > it"
>> >
>> > Ok that really is IT for me. I AM on vacation and if you all
>> really > BELIEVE that you can tape anything you want off TV ( or buy

>> a copy from > someone who did) I am in the WRONG business.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Quoting "Brewer, Michael" <brewerm@u.library.arizona.edu>:
>> >
>> > > Jessica,
>> > >
>> > > I am just trying to understand the law here. I am working
>> through it, > > > so please don't jump to any conclusions on my
>> motives. It is simply > > my way of investigating the question.
>> > >
>> > > I am just coming to terms with the fact that a copy can be legal

>> for > > certain purposes, and not for others. If the making of the
>> copy is > > done for fair use purposes, then the use of that copy,
>> it seems, would > > > also always have to be limited to other
>> purposes that fit within fair > use.
>> > >
>> > > Of course, this seems obvious, but I had always considered a
>> copy > > either legal or illegal, not legal or illegal based on the
>> context of > its use.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > In the section 108 scenario (film is excluded from this portion
>> of > > 108), the copy is clearly legal, but can, then, the owner of
>> the copy > > do whatever he/she wants with it? The burden is put on

>> the > > library/archive, rather than the owner, so it just isn't
clear to me.
> > > >
>> > > mb
>> > >
>> > > Michael Brewer
>> > > Slavic Studies, German Studies & Media Arts Librarian University

>> of > > Arizona Library A210 1510 E. University P.O. Box 210055
>> Tucson, AZ > > 85721 > > Voice: 520.307.2771 > > Fax: 520.621.9733

>> > > brewerm@u.library.arizona.edu > > > > -----Original
>> Message----- > > From: owner-videolib@lists.berkeley.edu > >
>> [mailto:owner-videolib@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of > >
>> jrosner@kino.com > > Sent: Friday, July 28, 2006 3:36 PM > > To:
>> videolib@lists.berkeley.edu > > Subject: RE: [Videolib] off air
>> recording and copyright > > > > Actually an "off air" copy is fact
>> an illegal copy The "guidelines "
>> > > were presumably gesture of realism to allow teachers to use
>> items > > short term but it was NEVER agreed to by rights holders
>> and as you are > > > all fond of pointing out has no official place

>> in copyright law. The > > Betamax decision was again VERY clear that

>> taping was legal ONLY for > > home/personal use.
>> > > The idea that you can tape someting off TV and just use it
>> because > > essentially it has not been released for your
>> convenience by the > > rights holder is totally absurd and makes a
>> mockery of the entire > > concept of a "legal copy". Under your
>> theory this would extend to > > bootleg copies sold on ebay IF they
>> were taped of TV because heck does > > > it matter WHO taped them ?
>> > > Home made videos are NOT legal copies and I want to ask Michael
>> if you > > > are anyone on the list seriously doubts that if this
>> went to court, it > > > would if anything lead to elimination of
>> the guidlines and prevent the > > > use of ANY off air item.
>> > >
>> > > Bascically what is going on here is an attempt to justify using

>> > > clearly illegal material because heck educatators ought to be
>> able to > > use anything they want and while you would LIKE to
>> obtain it legally , > > > you will get it anyway you can.
>> > >
>> > > I find it not only legally ridiculous but insulting to
>> filmmakers, > > distributors, actors etc and everyone else involved
>> in works who would > > > expect LIBARIANS at least to respect
>> copyright > > > > > > Quoting "Brewer, Michael"
>> <brewerm@u.library.arizona.edu>:
>> > >
>> > > > All,
>> > > >
>> > > > Cindy,
>> > > >
>> > > > I think it depends on how the photocopy was acquired. If a >

>> > > professor acquired a copy of an out of print book (and
>> unavailable > > > for purchase) through a library or archive that
>> copied it for him > under Section 108, > > > then his further legal

>> use of that copy should not pose any issues.
>> >
>> > > >
>> > > > It is true that 108 states that the library should not make a
>> copy > > > of > > an > > > entire work for a user if they have
>> reason to believe it will be > > > used for purposes other than
>> research, scholarship & private study > > purposes.
>> > > > However, that is for the library to worry about at the time
>> the copy > > was > > > made. If the professor later decides he/she

>> would like to put this > > book > > > on reserve (or do anything
>> else with it that is legal), there is > > nothing > > > saying
>> he/she can't. There is no license that comes with the item > >
>> saying > > > it can only be used in a particular way.
>> > > >
>> > > > Additionally, is an off-air copy in fact an illegal copy? How

>> can > > > it > > be > > > a legal copy for a certain amount of
>> time, and then suddenly > illegal?
>> > > I
>> > > > don't think it is the copy that is illegal here (though I
>> could be > > wrong > > > - I'd like to hear if others have more
>> info on this). The question > > is, > > > is the use illegal.
>> > > >
>> > > > Anyone have more info on this one?
>> > > >
>> > > > mb
>> > > >
>> > > > Michael Brewer
>> > > > Slavic Studies, German Studies & Media Arts Librarian
>> University of > > > Arizona Library A210 1510 E. University P.O. Box

>> 210055 Tucson, AZ > > > 85721 > > > Voice: 520.307.2771 > > > Fax:

>> 520.621.9733 > > > brewerm@u.library.arizona.edu > > > > > >
>> -----Original Message----- > > > From:
>> owner-videolib@lists.berkeley.edu
> > > > > [mailto:owner-videolib@lists.berkeley.edu] On Behalf Of
>> > > > Badilla-Melendez, Cindy
>> > > > Sent: Friday, July 28, 2006 9:00 AM > > > To:
>> 'videolib@lists.berkeley.edu'
>> > > > Subject: RE: [Videolib] off air recording and copyright > > >

>> > > > Would you put on course reserve an entire book made on
>> photocopy? I > > > would not.
>> > > >
>> > > > We don't put on course reserve anything that is a illegal
copy.
>> > > > __________________________________________________
>> > > > Cindy Badilla-Melendez
>> > > > Media Resources Librarian
>> > > > O'Shaughnessy-Frey Library,
>> > > > University of St. Thomas
>> > > > phone (651) 962-5464
>> > > > fax (651) 962-5406
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > From: Rick Provine [mailto:provine@depauw.edu] > > > Sent:
>> Friday, July 28, 2006 10:22 AM > > > To:
>> ghandman@library.berkeley.edu; videolib@lists.berkeley.edu > > >
>> Subject: Re: [Videolib] off air recording and copyright > > > > > >

>> i certainly wouldn't add it to the collection...but we are talking >

>> > about > > > a personal copy on reserve...
>> > > >
>> > > > >>> ghandman@library.berkeley.edu 7/28/2006 11:08:08 AM >>> >

>> > > yeah, I agree, Rick. Classroom use of stuff, OK, but the
>> sticking > > > point is whether long-term retention (for eg in a
>> library > > > collection) meets Fair Use tests...I personally don't
think it does.
>> > > >
>> > > > Gary
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > At 06:59 AM 7/28/2006, you wrote:
>> > > > >I will take a stab at this one...
>> > > > >
>> > > > >Lets look at the Fair Use argument. Just becauise the
>> off-air > > > >guidelines exist, that doesn't mean you can't make a
>> Fair Use case > > > for > > > >an off-air recording. This one
>> seems compelling to me.
>> > > > >
>> > > > >- It is not commercially available (at any price, much less
>> a > > > >"reasonable" price) > > > >- The impact on the original
>> work is nil > > > >- The purpose of the use is educational, and you
>> are not making > > > copies > > > >or otherwise distributing > > >

>> > > > > >The fact that the content is not available any other way,
>> and there > > > is > > > >no other available means for the faculty
>> member to utilize this > > > content > > > >for his course makes
>> this a defensible fair use argument. If this > > > were > > > >a
>> Disney title, who deliberately manipulates out-of-print periods > >
>> > >to increase market value, it might be different. There is a used

>> > > > >market and there are options to obtain legal copies.
>> > > > >
>> > > > >But where is the harm here relative to the educational value?
>> > > > >Education is not in and of itself the criteria for fair use,
>> but it > > is > > > a > > > >factor and, in this case, feels right

>> to me. I would allow it in > > > this > > > >case.
>> > > > >
>> > > > >Rick
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > >_____________________________ > > > >Rick Provine > > >
>> >Director of Libraries > > > >DePauw University > > > >11 East
>> Larabee Street > > > >Greencastle, IN 46135 > > >
>> >provine@depauw.edu > > > >office 765-658-4435 > > > >mobile
>> 765-301-0262 > > > >fax 765-658-4445 > > > > > > > > >>>
>> cmhealy@waketech.edu 7/28/2006 9:25 AM >>> > > > >OK,OK - > > >
>> >Wait one second here. I know copyright is murky and filled with >
>> > > >mere guidelines as opposed to rules and laws and I know that
>> there > > > >are no copyright police around to bust me, but one area

>> I am > > > >confident > > > about > > > >is off-air taping. It
>> does not seem ambiguous that off-air tapes > > > >are good for only

>> a short time - 10 days ish - and then they have > > > >to be
>> destroyed.
>> > > > >
>> > > > >I am really surprised that at least two replies to my initial

>> query > > > > >have suggested that this prof can go right on ahead
>> and put a three > > > > >year old taped-from-TV show on reserve. I
>> also know that copyright > > > >law is constantly up for
>> interpretation but this seems a clear > > > >case. I don't think it
>> even merits "a closer look". If this item > > > >doesn't clearly
>> violate copyright, I will turn in my jr. deputy
> > > > > >copyright cop badge and decoder ring for good and let things

> slide
>> > > > >which would make every single person I work with jump for
joy.
>> > > > >
>> > > > >Those of you who are academic librarians who work directly
>> with > > > >media and who don't care to hedge you bets with "take
another look"
>> >
>> > > > >or "probably" or "depending on the details", please state
>> clearly > > > >why > > > you > > > >would absolutely put this old
>> home made tape on reserve.
>> > > > >
>> > > > >Ciara
>> > > > >
>> > > > > >>> notaro@stpt.usf.edu 7/28/2006 8:22 am >>> > > > > > >
>> > > > FYI I have off air copies of THE GLITTERING PRIZES which PBS >

>> > > > > aired in the late 70s. It is considered to be one the best >

>> > > > > British series ever made. Never released in any format in any

>> > > > > > country Think I can loan out those puppies for classroom
use ?
>> > > > >
>> > > > >Absolutely!
>> > > > >
>> > > > >Jerry
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > >VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively
>> discussion > > > >of issues relating to the selection, evaluation,
>> > > > >acquisition,bibliographic control, preservation, and use of
>> current > > > > >and evolving video formats in libraries and
>> related institutions.
>> > > > >It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective working
>> tool > > > >for video librarians, as well as a channel of
>> communication between > > > > >libraries,educational institutions,
>> and > > > video > > > >producers and distributors.
>> > > > >VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively
>> discussion > > > >of issues relating to the selection, evaluation,
>> > > > acquisition,bibliographic > > > >control, preservation, and
>> use of current and evolving video > > > >formats > > > in > > >
>> >libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will
>> > > > serve > > > >as an effective working tool for video
>> librarians, as well as a > > > channel > > > >of communication
>> between libraries,educational institutions, and > > > video > > >
>> >producers and distributors.
>> > > > >VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively
>> discussion > > > >of issues relating to the selection, evaluation,
>> > > > >acquisition,bibliographic control, preservation, and use of
>> current > > > > >and evolving video formats in libraries and
>> related institutions.
>> > > > >It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective working
>> tool > > > >for video librarians, as well as a channel of
>> communication between > > > > >libraries,educational institutions,
>> and video producers and > > > distributors.
>> > > >
>> > > > Gary Handman
>> > > > Director
>> > > > Media Resources Center
>> > > > Moffitt Library
>> > > > UC Berkeley
>> > > > ghandman@library.berkeley.edu
>> > > > http://www.lib.berkeley.edu/MRC > > > > > > ***** > > > >
>> > > "In societies where modern conditions of production prevail,
>> > > > all of life presents itself as an immense
accumulation
>> > > > of spectacles."
>> > > > --Guy Debord
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively
>> discussion of > > > > issues relating to the selection, evaluation,

>> > > acquisition,bibliographic > > > control, preservation, and use
>> of current and evolving video formats > > in > > > libraries and
>> related institutions. It is hoped that the list will > > serve > >
>> > as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a >
>> > channel > > > of communication between libraries,educational
>> institutions, and > > > video producers and distributors.
>> > > > VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively
>> discussion of > > > > issues relating to the selection, evaluation,

>> > > > acquisition,bibliographic control, preservation, and use of
>> current > > > and evolving video formats in > > libraries > > >
>> and > > > related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve

>> as an > > > effective working tool for video librarians, as well as
>> a channel of > > communication > > > between libraries,educational
>> institutions, and video producers and
> > > > > distributors.
>> > > > VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively
>> discussion of > > > > issues relating to the selection, evaluation,

>> > > acquisition,bibliographic > > > control, preservation, and use
>> of current and evolving video formats > > in > > > libraries and
>> related institutions. It is hoped that the list will > > serve > >
>> > as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a >
>> > channel > > > of communication between libraries,educational
>> institutions, and > > > video producers and distributors.
>> > > >
>> > > > VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively
>> discussion of > > issues > > > relating to the selection,
>> evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic > > control, > > >
>> preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in > >
>> libraries and > > > related institutions. It is hoped that the list
>> will serve as an > > effective > > > working tool for video
>> librarians, as well as a channel of > > communication > > > between

>> libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and > > >
>> distributors.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively
>> discussion of > > issues relating to the selection, evaluation, > >

>> acquisition,bibliographic control, preservation, and use of current
>> > > and evolving video formats in libraries and related institutions.

>> It > > is hoped that the list will serve as an effective working
>> tool for > > video librarians, as well as a channel of communication

>> between > > libraries,educational institutions, and video producers
>> and > distributors.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively
>> discussion of > > issues relating to the selection, evaluation, > >

>> acquisition,bibliographic control, preservation, and use of current
>> > > and evolving video formats in libraries and related institutions.

>> It > > is hoped that the list will serve as an effective working
>> tool for > > video librarians, as well as a channel of communication

>> between > > libraries,educational institutions, and video producers
>> and > distributors.
>> >
>> >
>> > VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion
>> of > issues relating to the selection, evaluation,
>> acquisition,bibliographic > control, preservation, and use of
>> current and evolving video formats in > libraries and related
>> institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve > as an effective

>> working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel > of
>> communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video
> producers and distributors.
>>
>>
>> VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of

>> issues relating to the selection, evaluation,
>> acquisition,bibliographic control, preservation, and use of current
>> and evolving video formats in libraries and related institutions. It

>> is hoped that the list will serve as an effective working tool for
>> video librarians, as well as a channel of communication between
>> libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and
distributors.
>
>
>VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of
>issues relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic

>control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in

>libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will
>serve as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a
>channel of communication between libraries,educational institutions,
>and video producers and distributors.

--
____________________________________________________
M. Claire Stewart
Head, Digital Media Services, Marjorie I. Mitchell Multimedia Center
Coordinator of Digitization Projects, Northwestern University Library
(847) 467-1437
claire-stewart@northwestern.edu
http://www.library.northwestern.edu/cstewart/
http://copyrightreadings.blogspot.com
VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of
issues relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic
control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in
libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve
as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel
of communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video
producers and distributors.

VIDEOLIB is intended to encourage the broad and lively discussion of issues relating to the selection, evaluation, acquisition,bibliographic control, preservation, and use of current and evolving video formats in libraries and related institutions. It is hoped that the list will serve as an effective working tool for video librarians, as well as a channel of communication between libraries,educational institutions, and video producers and distributors.