Re: [Videolib] Internet 2

Media2 (media2@bellatlantic.net)
Thu, 31 Jul 2003 15:49:16 -0400

Mark, you gotta work on that stutter. Point understood. Last time I
looked they wanted $20,000 too, so the cost of entry hasn't come down.
When I first saw the Release posted a couple of years back I couldn't
believe they were serious. I still can't believe it. A k12 district or
IU has to have an innovative digital product or system they are willing
to share with the group AND has to put $20,000 into the pot.! You and
I have to stop all this pipe dreaming, . . . high-speed-
fiber-optic-pipe-dreaming, yea, that's the ticket, big
fiberpipedreaming . . . but lookit. We're back to taking about
speed, last mile costs, IP2 formats . . . what will be the nature of
the content in the pipe? who will produce it? will anybody be willing
to pay for it if they produce it? . . . . . geez that's a lot of
questions for someone from new jersey. OK, back to reality. Most of
our schools ran out of photocopy paper in April and a couple want to
drop the T-1 lines back to DSL speed to save money . . . go figure.
Cheers - MLR
"The difficulty of getting anything started increases with the
square of the number of people involved." Corollary of the Third, Jim
MacGregor

Mark W. Kopp wrote:

> Mark, Mark, Mark,!!!
>
> My point was the speed, not the format. I know, as well as you, that
> DVD MPEG2 is not the format for the Internet. I merely offered the
> comparison, to give those interested, some benchmark of how much info
> could be moved in a VERY small amount of time.
>
> My opinion is that the standard format of Video delivery has not been
> developed yet, and will not be developed until the next level of the
> Internet (whether it is I2, or a cross-breed of current and new
> pipelines) is FIRMLY established. The last I heard, joining the
> Abilene Network costs over $20,000 per year! ...and that doesn't
> include your "last Mile" costs!!!
>
> At this point, I think our dreams are well ahead of technology, or at
> least ahead of any level of funding that could make it all happen the
> way we like.
>
> Mark K.
> ************************************************
> At 04:44 PM 7/30/03 -0400, you wrote:
>
>> I've been lurking I2 sites for about 4 years and agree that some
>> coordinated effort was needed to upgrade/replace the information goat
>> path that now passes for the Internet. If only to handle the rapid
>> growth of bandwidth intensive spam from korea.
>>
>> What I can't get all warm and fuzzy about is the concept of
>> streaming a DVD Video over I2 or over Ione for that matter. First of
>> all, why not stream from an MPEG 2 FILE rather than from a DVD Video
>> where mechanical speed limits the transfer rate and adds a labor
>> intensive element? Second, most monitors can't fully resolve the
>> upper quality of MPEG 2, so why take up bandwidth moving image data
>> that is beyond the capacity of the viewing side to use? Third,
>> streaming a DVD, so far, still can't use the interactive options
>> found in most Feature Film discs. A capacity that has little
>> relevance to the k-12 classroom. The end result is still a linear
>> video.
>>
>> Needing a bigger pipeline to download data or VIDEO FILES was just as
>> inevitable as the need for multilane roads. But the amount of
>> bandwidth being consumed by redundant video streaming instead of a
>> single download is an unnecessary load on the net and the LAN. Why
>> expect a 12th grade chemistry teacher to stream the same video four
>> times a day to use with four sections? If a college professor
>> assigns prep work for a class that includes viewing a specific video
>> on exothermic dynamics, is it cost effective to build out a college
>> dorm network to handle 30 to 200 simultaneous MPEG 2 streams at
>> 15MB/s? A moot point no doubt since the number of professors inclined
>> to take advantage of that option is infinitesimally small.
>>
>> Downloading the entire NEXUS data base over I2 in 37 seconds holds
>> great advantages, but the magic cookie of using MPEG 2 for video
>> streaming and storage, ceased upon by the general and educational
>> press, continues to amaze me. Just the size of the files reduces the
>> number of titles that can be held on the library server.
>>
>> At long last, have we have lost sight of the mission? We are content
>> providers. Yes, I would like my 158 schools to have OC-16 access
>> speeds. But I would rather they be more concerned about the quality
>> of the content. Meanwhile, k12 producers invest more in digital
>> issues with less to put into replacing dated productions. The
>> regional centers invest more in digital/IP infrastructure and less in
>> content acquisition.
>>
>> This is could be worse than switching from acetate to Estar®, and
>> THAT was going to end the world as we know it . . .
>>
>> M. Richie
>> Department of Redundancy Department
>>
>> "Having lost sight of our mission, we have redoubled our efforts."
>> NJ Department of Education
>>
>>
>> Mark W. Kopp wrote:
>>
>>> For those of you who are interested in IP delivery of Digitized
>>> Video, this should be of great interest. Internet2 is the next step
>>> in IP evolution. It provides for astronomical download speeds and is
>>> being developed by the educational community, primarily at the
>>> University level.
>>>
>>> The speeds of I2 are so fast that with an I2 connection, you could
>>> download a full 4.5 gig DVD (that's a DVD, not a CD) in less than 3
>>> seconds! It might not be feasible for most institutions right now,
>>> but it is the future of the web. This would allow full motion
>>> streaming to be the norm rather than a wish.
>>>
>>> The link provided is to an article from eschoolnews, an e-zine for
>>> educators, so you'll have to enter your name and register to view
>>> the article...but it's well worth your time.
>>>
>>> Announcement of I2 availability to K-12 institutions:
>>> http://www.eschoolnews.com/news/showStory.cfm?ArticleID=344&ref=wo
>>> <http://www.eschoolnews.com/news/showStory.cfm?ArticleID=344&ref=wo>
>>> <http://www.eschoolnews.com/news/showStory.cfm?ArticleID=344&ref=wo
>>> <http://www.eschoolnews.com/news/showStory.cfm?ArticleID=344&ref=wo>>
>>>
>>> ****************************************************************************
>>>
>>> Mark W. Kopp
>>> Circulation Coordinator
>>> Appalachia Intermediate Unit 8
>>> Instructional Materials Services Department
>>> 580 Foot of Ten Road
>>> Duncansville, Pa 16635
>>> (814) 695-1972 Phone
>>> (814) 695-3018 Fax
>>> E-Address:
>>> mailto:iu8film@iu08.org
>>> See us on the Web at:
>>> http://www.iu08.org <http://www.iu08.org/>
>>> Click on; "Instructional Materials Services"
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Videolib mailing list
>> Videolib@library.berkeley.edu
>> http://www.lib.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/videolib
>
> ****************************************************************************
>
> Mark W. Kopp
> Circulation Coordinator
> Appalachia Intermediate Unit 8
> Instructional Materials Services Department
> 580 Foot of Ten Road
> Duncansville, Pa 16635
> (814) 695-1972 Phone
> (814) 695-3018 Fax
> E-Address:
> mailto:iu8film@iu08.org
> See us on the Web at:
> http://www.iu08.org
> Click on; "Instructional Materials Services"
>
>

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